Hi, I was wondering if anyone with personal experience would give me suggestions on woofers for my A7 setup? I have late 825 cabinets that I'm getting ready to totally redo and brace, etc... These were the PA version loaded with 421a woofers & 511b / 808a tops (symbiotic) - 800 hz Altec crossover. I have put away the 511s & 808s for now. I am using 902-8b drivers with Mantaray horns from model 14s for the top. Yes, I realize they need to be crossed over higher but just using what I have to work with. I am using them for both music and home theater duty along with a moderate subwoofer. They actually sound very good as they are. The top end is to die for and very satisfying. The 421 woofers get a bad rap for some reason but they sound fine to me. Anyways, I was wanting to try some new GPA woofers or either have my 418b woofers reconed to 416s. Here's where I need help. I can have the 418 woofers reconed to 416 or either buy new 416, 515LF or 515GHP. I like the idea of the 416 as everyone says they have more bottom end. But in the A7 setup, would it really matter that much? I don't think any of the 3 will have any real bass in the A7 cabinets. Also, I am running a subwoofer. I spoke to Bill at GPA and he recommended 416. But if I wanted to go with 515, I should go with the LF version. The LF version has a heavier cone. I would really like to have a woofer that would keep up sensitivity-wise, close to the 902s / Mantarays. I was thinking that the GHP version since it was more efficient would be a better match, take more power and also that I am running a subwoofer. Bill said he didn't like the 515GHP because it was all mids and no bass - very light cone. So now, I'm kind of scratching my head as what to do. I like to play them very loud at times also. BTW. these are in a medium sized but long living room. Thanks!
I allways wondered why everyone says to get the 416 over the 515, and in the next instance they say to get a 604 instead of the 605? ive had all kinds of woofers in the 828/825 cabs and I prefer the 515... faster , stronger, and louder, and in the case of the 515e..way more midbass punch
"those sounds to which no definite pitch can be assigned are usually classified as noise"<br />harvey fletcher-1928
The 416 goes a tad (pun intended) lower, 515 has more mid bass. You pays yer money and you takes yer choices.
Your neighbors called. They like your music.
Just my .02...................... and it won't be any too popular i'm sure.I like to play them very loud at times also.
Either damp the hell outta the aluminum domes on the 421's, or cut them out and replace them with soft paper.
Any other alternative is looking to throw significant money at very diminishing returns versus what you already have.
I have rotated a LOT of woofers thru my 828's. If i felt i had to run Altec branded woofers in them, i'd be hard on the prowl for 421-8LF's and give them the treatment i mentioned above.
Not all vegetables make good leaders.
Originally Posted by bowtie427ss
I have had good luck just installing a 4 inch dome,I prefer felt....and leaving the 421 dome alone. YMMV.
Your neighbors called. They like your music.
I sure do like the sound of the 421s if you cross them lower than about 2,000 hz. They really do good in my opinion but don't get as much respect as the 416 & 515s. Sound fine in the A7 setup and take a good amount of power. Plenty to get very loud & dynamic... I was thinking of dampening the dustcap but not sure if I will get any noticeable difference. Old Guy has the best idea for dampening them. I will try that approach.
I just wanted to try to some 416s or 515s to see what the hype is about. I would like to try the 515GHP (GPA) woofer in them. I'd say it would be mid-bass & midrange heaven. Paired with the 902 / model 14 mantarays, should be really good from mids up and closer to matched efficiency too. Then run a really good sub to fill in the bottom and all should be great.
Last edited by hemicuda; June 18th, 2014 at 08:58 PM.
The 4 inch cap covers the 3 inch stock cap. The slight added mass will lower the speaker resonance a little.
A felt cap has almost no added overtones, where a hard paper cap does. Not necessary to have a vent hole in the center
I have a gut feeling these will work well with less mass....
Speaker Dust Cap For Speaker Repair, Mesh Screen, DC-4S
My experience with modded 421's has been 1200-1600 xover is best. We used tons of them, eventually changed to 3156 for better power handling, but IMHO 421 sounded better.
Your neighbors called. They like your music.
Well, if you take a low-and-grow approach, you can recone and see if you like. If you're hungry for more, you sell the recones and get the new 416s from GPA. I am part of the 416 hype, but damn, they sound good. I just don't have the 828 cabinet, so YMMV. But what I like so much about them is that full mid-bass, and if the 515's have even more of that goodness, then I'm on the lookout for some. I still run a sub with my 416s.
- Mike
Simply because that's what Altec used/recommended until separate sub systems came along and they reinstated an A5 model. Me, I'd rather have the 515 and use a little EQ to flatten it to a lower F3, but as has been pointed out, the bass is heavily shelved down regardless, requiring significant room gain to offset it. Stick a 411 in it if you want bass and use a large horn with a <500 Hz XO.
GM
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.......or just coat them with rubber cement.
GM
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Originally, there was a very noticeable sonic difference between the 416, 515 [no comparison to my ears], but I've read/heard that some later ones and GPA's are almost same-same sonically, but no personal experience to comment. Makes sense really, Altec consolidating parts as the company was being gutted and Bill winding up with the parts, tooling used at the end, so maybe the 'magic' is gone from the 515 with the trade-off being a better overall 416. FWIW, mine have enough HF 'sweetness' to XO them to super-tweeter horns at 5 kHz/2nd order! Can anyone do it with even a GPA 416 without a huge dip in the response and/or without obvious HF break-up modes 'shout'?
GM
Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.
Probably can come pretty close, GM. In my GPA 416 thread, my measurements showed pretty flat response out to about 3900 Hz. They definitely have some range on them! I'd love to hear a refurbed Model 19 with the new GPA 416s loaded, and the crossovers modified for the new woofer. I would bet they sound fantastic. Sorry if this is a derail of your thread Hemi!
- Mike
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